(0:00)Why 6-Year-Olds Have Girlfriends Now
I really do think we've got a problem. You know, um, our producer Aqua was telling us that his six-year-old kid, right? Six-year-old boy comes home and says, "Daddy, some of my classmates have girlfriends at six." You know, if a six-year-old is already talking about girlfriends, right? Then what does he do at 10:00? Unfiltered.
(0:22)Welcome Back: New Co-Host Bemi
Welcome back everybody. Welcome back to PF Unfiltered. My name is Esther Griffin and I have a new co-host with me today and her name is My name is Roslin Noha. Some of y'all know me as Bemi. Hey. All right. Okay. But y'all know me. Y'all know me. We are happy to be back. Um, if you haven't subscribed yet, please go ahead and subscribe, like, um, comment, share this content. Um, today we're going to be recapping from last week. um and going into a new topic this week as it relates to last week's topic and really what we discussed last week was it was basically about you know dating boundaries how should one date in this today's society and basically you know PF was talking about communities finding friendships and having that foundation so and he left us with a lot to talk about today yeah and that was that's actually why I came I wanted my question to be answered oh my god it's going to be one of those days how did you guys let in here. You knew she had an axe to grind. Guys, Roslin has an axe to grind. Okay, so put that in context. And of course, we have our one and only, myself, aka aka Uncle P aka Pastor Fam, aka lead pastor of New Covenant House, aka Is that it? Wow, you guys are boring, man. Tunday Tunday is not here today, guys. Um, he is attending to things. Yeah, he's looking after his wife. Yeah, I hope you're looking after your wife. I know. Watching football or soccer somewhere. Just FYI. FYI. Watching the draft. Um, well, it should be over by now, actually. Are you into football? Are you into American football, Pia? No. Are you into any sports? No. Oh, you don't have a soccer team? No. Not even Manchester United? No. Manny, you go away. See, see, this is my problem with sports,
(2:30)Sports Are A Waste Of Time?
right? Sports are too serious to be sports. There's nothing okay entertaining about sports. There is. There's so much entertaining about it. Why? Entertainment is supposed to compete. Entertainment is supposed to make me feel relaxed and happy. Sports just increases my blood pressure. Oh, okay. Sorry for you. Yeah. So, you know, I'd rather watch a 30inut sitcom about stuff I don't remember, have a good laugh, and be done with it. Yeah. Yeah. So, you didn't watch the Olympics last year? Olympics? Why? The Olympics are fun. Really? Listen, PF like I find them extremely boring. Cause drama. Grown grown men and women running around doing nothing. People dedicate their lives to this. That's a problem, right? No. How about dedicating your life to the gospel? Something meaningful, something that has eternal value. When you get to heaven, what did you do with your life? Oh, I ran around a field chasing a pig skin. Mercy. Like, oh no, I ran around a track, you know, just 100 meters. I just what? So, what happened? What was chasing you? I just ran around. Sport is an insult. That's a big insult to our sport. See, I aspire that when I get to heaven. Yes. Or when I meet my creator, he will say, "Well done, good and faithful servant." Yes. Right. Um I I hope that if anybody were to ask me, "What did you do with the time on earth that we gave you?" I would be able to say more than I run around in circles. But you do more than you do more than run around in circles. What you you train to run around in circles. No, you train to run around in circles, but you come across people. You meet people in different paths. There's a lot that you do. And and they look up to you because they also aspire to run around. excellence in running around in circles. That's not how to be excellent. Well, running in a straight line against other people that think that they're fast, right? That run that. It sounds like you used to be an athlete. I I am an athlete. That That explains a lot. That explains it. Active. I I know. I I'm grateful that you have decided not to waste your life running around in circles or running in straight line and back straight. I mean, she's a great example that she's an athlete and she's I do other things. No, she's not. She's she's not an athlete. She used to be an athlete. No, I'm currently an athlete. When was the last time you competed? All right. When was the last time you wasted a season of your life? No, not a season. I've never wasted any season of my life. No. Amen. Amen. Amen, sister. Okay. Okay. Back to me. By the way, I respect I respect I respect athletes, too. Just FYI. I respect you. The floor is yours. We came We came here just for you. Wow. Okay. FYI, I made me a single,
(5:09)The Single Life: A Deep Dive
y'all. So, wait. Pause. What? Any of the guys that How did we How did we get into this? Are you single? Baby is single. No, let's put baby on the spot cuz I know there's I don't think I don't think we need to put me on the spot. Are you single? Let's get back to Earth. You better answer cuz there are people watching. Are you single? I think you're looking for somebody now. Baby, listen. Let me tell you, Esther. You said that. Don't get in trouble. Bam is not single. Bam is B's in a relationship. She's in a relationship. So, she's dating. Yeah, he's doing something. I don't know. Wow. I'm dating. I'm not married. So, what is dating again? I thought dating was when you get to know somebody, right? Well, according to you, PF, dating is boyfriend and girlfriend. So, I said you have a boyfriend and girlfriend. So, you've got a boyfriend. Can you can you just run me through the stages? Because I get confused. And according to PF, dating doesn't wait. Let's even tell the stage. So, when you meet somebody, what is that? When you meet them, you're getting to know the person. Okay. And then what happens next? And then you finally start dating. And that dating starts when you guys go out on the first date. Okay. So, so, so what part of it is talking? Cuz I I've heard that people
(6:15)Dating vs. 'Talking': What Are We Doing?
say we're talking. Yeah, that talking thing. I don't know what people are doing. I guess that talking is before you go on the first date because to me the when you go on that date, that is you're dating him. Okay. So, you go on one date? Not nec not necessarily. Yeah. I guess everybody has different definitions. You see the problem? Yeah. You see the problem? Okay. So when you talking to somebody, that doesn't mean that y'all officially are boyfriend and girlfriend or you guys are officially dating. It's just getting to know the person and it's entertainment for the time being until things are made up. Entertainment is crazy. Listen, call a spade a spade. If I have somebody on my line on your line, yes, somebody on my line. You see what I was saying, guys? You see the problem? Thank you, Sister Esa, for preaching my message. No, this I mean that's just what it is. If I have somebody on my line, we're getting to know each other. We're just talking. We're not boyfriend and girlfriend. So there's no exclusivity. There's no exclusivity. So he can be talking to multiple people. Yeah, he could be if that's what we agreed upon. You could be talking to multiple people. Me? Yes. Let's be clear. Okay. I ain't going to be caught slipping out here. And I Okay. But thank God I'm married. So we left that life. We left that life in the past. Hallelujah. It's a very good thing God cuz this, like we said last episode, by the way, watch it. This streets are they're not they're not nice. They're not they're not nice. a question. Before you got to this person that you're with now. Yeah. Currently claiming has her boyfriend. How was the how was your dating history? Like what was that? What was the journey like? Tell us. It was a very much up and
(7:45)Heartbreak And Learning The Hard Way
down journey. I would say um wow. Looks like we're interviewing women today. Um I would say that the journey was really like just getting to know different type of people. I also grew as well. So, what the people that I dated, they most definitely influenced how I came into the next relationship. So, was it rough? Um, I would say yes, I did. Did you get your heart broken? I got my heart broken. Um, you broke a few hearts. Woohoo crying. What's boohoo crying? Like snot coming down and you don't want to leave the room type crying. I see. I got you. Okay. Yeah. And how did you end up there? How did I end up there? Like in those type of in that situation that you was boohoo crying cuz I'm not crying over nobody period. I he had some the vibes were great and I was thinking that this is like a great person to date. But then were y'all dating or y'all were talking? No, we were dating like he was your boyfriend. He was calling me I'm this is my girl, this is my babe, all that stuff. He asked you to be his girlfriend. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I always make sure of that cuz that's how the guy will quickly say, "But we were just talking. We weren't really that serious." And it's just like talking face. Yeah. That's how guys will they will use words to mess with the girl's mind. And that's something that right I I think I think you know I I really do think we've got a problem. You know, um, our producer opera was telling us that his six-year-old kid, right? Six year old boy comes home and says, "Daddy, some of my classmates have girlfriends at six, you know, if if a six-year-old is already talking about girlfriends, right? Then what does he do at 10? What does he do at 15? What does he do at 20?" Right? and and we don't realize how and and I think Esther or was it um Roslin said it was a good thing that he was able to bring that to his dad and I think it's a great thing but I worry right that in our desire to accommodate and be open and be a sounding sounding board uh you know a safe space for our children to tell us anything that we have also become um enablers of everything M right. Um because when your child comes and tells you that kind of thing, your instinct is to, oh great, my child can talk to me about it. Right. But what they're
(10:15)Are We Enabling Our Kids Too Much?
talking to you about is not something they should be talking to you about. It's not something they should be knowing about. Yeah. The fact that they know about that is a problem. At 6 years old, all kids, we should all be friends, right? There should be no pairing up, you know? There should be no, we're just a bunch of friends. And nine times out of 10 when we were growing up, the girls didn't like the guys. The guys didn't like the girls. And we all just, you know, played like nothing. But then by the time a six-year-old is telling you, "My girlfriend, I promise you by 10 you'll be doing engagement ceremony." That is kind of dramatic. Engagement ceremony. I think talking you'll be talking contraception. Okay. Well, we're not there yet. And that's what we're going to get there because people are already people I'm a pastor, right? And but I'm also a realist. Yeah. And I don't believe in burying my head in the sand. I like to smell the coffee. Yeah. Right. We are living in a world where things are actually deteriorating and the sooner we realize that the better for all of us and and start dealing with it like it's not going to get better. Yeah. So now, so based off of where we left off last time, right, there there felt like there was the consensus was almost like there was no hope, right? And I think what people want to know now is how do you go from, you know, like you said, instead of going through a quote unquote dating phase, why don't you become friends, be in community, and once you've determined that you like someone, make that initial um connection. How do people go from friendship into relationship or into um biblical relationship where they've determined that this person is going to be my wife or my husband? Before I I ask that question. So just hold that thought. I just want to say something about about people not having hope. Yeah. Right. I don't want you to have hope in the world in worldly systems. There's no hope in worldly systems. Right. Because worldly systems are part of a world that has been judged. But there is hope in kingdom, right? And in kingdom patterns and kingdom systems and kingdom lifestyles, right? If we are dating, dating is a system created by the world, right? There's no hope in it. It will frustrate
(12:30)There Is No Hope In Worldly Systems
the people in the world and it will frustrate the people in the church. If you use the world's methods, you will get the world's results. If we conduct our marriages the way the world conducts marriages, we will get the same marriage statistics. If we date the way the world dates, we will get the same dating statistics. If we live on the same streets, we will feel the same pain. When the mud comes sliding down, it will hit every house. Right? So there is no hope in the world systems. And the church should stop trying to clean up the world systems. We can't clean it up. We need to go back to our own. But we don't know our own. And I think that's the problem. That is the irony though, right? That is the irony that we do not spend enough time in the word, right? Studying the word. Um um allowing the Holy Spirit develop in us the fruits of the spirit and dealing with each other according to the fruits of the spirit that have been developed in us. Right? There is no system in scripture for
(13:30)Why The Bible Has No 'Dating' System
dating. Right? Because dating is almost like saying it doesn't exist in scripture. So there's no system for what doesn't exist in scripture. What exists in the Bible are dealing with each other in certain ways. Right? If I deal with you according to the Bible. Yeah. Whether you are male or female, we will come to a fruitful um conclusion to the relationship. Right. If I I I meet a woman, right? and I deal with her as scripture says to deal with people as the Holy Spirit with the fruits of the spirit interacts with her. My relationship with that woman will develop where it should go. H how do we recognize what that looks like? You're putting the cat before the horse. Okay? Right? Let's develop the fruits of the spirit. Let's walk in the fruits of the spirit. Right? When you get there, you will see it. You will know it. Right? If the Holy Spirit working in me
(14:35)Developing Fruits Over Feelings
says, "And the fruit of the spirit is love and love is manifest as gentleness, as patience, as kindness." Right. Right. If I am kind to you, right, I will not deal with you as an object of my lust. That's good. Okay. Right. If you are kind to me, you will not see me as a ticket out of poverty. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And as our interaction with each other in kindness. Yeah. If any feelings develop separate from that, we will recognize it. Right. What about So I thought about that from a man's perspective. On a woman's perspective, could it be that if she was walking impatient, then she would not automatically assume that because he's kind to her, then that he likes her? Thank you. You know, there's just something, right, that God has put in place systems. One of the things that I struggle with in church is we have all these niche um niche training programs, leadership training, um husband training, wife training, all sorts of different You need those things though. Calm down. Calm down. All of them are programs. Wait, wait. Listen. All of these things are modeled on different aspects of Jesus's character. Mhm. Right. Yes. Why don't just train people to be like Jesus? We are. Uhhuh. Then the ones who are leaders, right, will express being like Jesus in their leadership roles, right? The ones who are husbands will express being like husbands as the way Jesus would express it. But if I teach you to be a husband separate from teaching you to be like Jesus, right, I've got I'm going to have a problem. Mhm. Because Jesus is a would be a good husband because he's Jesus. He's not a husband first. is Jesus first. I will always be a man first. If you teach me to be a good man, I will be a good husband. Full stop. If you teach me to be a good man, I will be a good leader if I am called to leadership. And if I'm not called to leadership, I will not be driven by my ego and my insecurities and my um um arrogance. Yeah. To position myself in leadership. Right. So we're training people to be leaders who that's not even the question we should be they should we should that's what we should be teaching them to be humble right Jesus Christ gave us a model of leadership serve y are we teaching people to serve let's teach people how to serve let's teach people how to humble themselves and serve others and then the ones who are leaders the ones who are leaders will rise to the role of leadership but they will not rise to the role of leadership by self anandrandisement when when the mother of His disciples came and said, "Please grant my son, my two sons to sit on your left hand." Jesus Christ said, "It is not my place to grant anybody anything." Right? That is not leadership. Leadership is you looking at everybody's talents and um giftings and commitment and assigning and delegating authority to them. He refused to delegate anything to anybody other than when he was leaving. I give you power when they you know what I'm saying? Mhm. Anyway, same thing with this, right? Let's teach people to be good Christians. Let's teach them to yield to the Holy Spirit, right? When they express the Holy Spirit in them, I I am convinced, yeah, that it will play out in every interaction and every situation as it should. I didn't want to agree with you, but I agree. Ah, so then I agree. So then would that I guess be considered training them as Jesus green like they're looking for green flags in the dating world. You see, you're back to the dating world again. Well, no. Okay, not dating world, but like you're back in dating world again, right? So, this is what I would look for in the in in this is what I would look for, right? As a as a Christian. Yeah. And and please guys, don't misunderstand me. I am not This is the ideal, right? I'm talking about the ideal. There's a reality, right? And what Rosaline is doing is pulling me back into reality because she's still she just came. She's fresh off the streets. Wait, it's been 3 years. Fresh off the streets. But you've been dating this guy for 3 years. Mhm. When are you guys getting married? All right, let's go back to your Let's hold on. This actually should be addressed. This is actually a great example for us to I think I think Let's be nice to Rosie. She might not come back. We haven't been dating for 3 years. Yeah, we didn't start off as friends. We didn't have that foundation as friends. So that's also you're developing a relationship. All right. Cool. So, so, so, so what was the question you asked me? Yeah. So, you were saying that let's train people as like Jesus. So, the traits of Jesus I was my question was are those the green flags, right? Are those the Okay. So, so let me tell you what would happen if you have you are full of the Holy Spirit. I'm full of the Holy Spirit. Right? One of the things that the Holy Spirit will do in you is grant you the ability to discern the extent of the Holy Spirit in me. Right? So it's not a question of green flags or red flags. It's a question of the spirit within you will bear witness to you that this person is a lunatic and you need to run for your life. No, right? You would discern it even though all the P's, all the all the tees are crossed, all the eyes are dotted, sparkling behavior, fantastic cologne, lovely Mercedes, all of that stuff. You will not be deceived, right? Because there's nothing that is hidden from the one with whom you have to do, right? So I can sit down and give So this is the problem with red flags. Red flags capture a snapshot of a person. Mhm. So, you see me today and you will see all my red flags and maybe you will see my green flags, but you have no idea what my tomorrow is going to be like. All of those red flags could be gone tomorrow, right? And all of those green flags could be gone tomorrow. So, you see, for example, you see a man, that's a good point. And he's very confident, right? In this moment, he's very confident, right? But what you don't realize is that his confidence is attached to his career. And if he loses his job, he's going to go from being Mr. Confident, Mr. Stability, Mr. Calm, Mr. Gentle, Mr. Considerate to Mr. Under Pressure, Mr. Self-centered, Mr. Borderline Narcissist, right? Yeah. Mr. He's so obsessed with getting a job and climbing the corporate ladder that he thinks of no one else. Oh, he fall into the depression. But when you met him, he had a job. Mhm. And so he looked perfect. But you didn't know that the perfection was not from within. It was from without. And when without changed, perfection went. Right? The Holy Spirit knows the end from the beginning. Yeah. So, how am I going to teach you, right, to spot something with your eyes that I know that what you see could be transient? And you could meet a guy today who is out of work, so he's insecure, right? He's out of work, he's embarrassed, right? and you're like, "Man, that guy is such a tightfisted, misily, insecure. I don't want to be around him. Tomorrow, something changes for him and the real him comes out." Right? I can't I can't tell you that. Right? We used to tell um um ladies about 10 years ago, when you go out on a date with a guy, make sure you watch how he treats people who around you. Around him. Yeah. watch how he treats the waiters, the valet and all of those things. And the boys were listening. So when they get to a restaurant, they're very kind to waiters. Very kind to valet. Oh, he's such a kind guy. My pastor said I should watch her. He treats everybody. And he treats everybody good cuz he knows you're watching and he knows that's what you're looking out for, right? And then he finally gets you and you find out that he's a wicked guy. wicked with a capital W and a capital I and C and K and E and D on top, but he knew how to present himself. He knew how to package himself. What about the girls that are led by the spirit, right? Yeah. And they end up with people that they thought the Lord told them to to date or that it was okay for them to get to know. If you think the Lord told you to date somebody, is it that everything the Lord tells you always ends up in milk and honey and roses? The journey to the promised land, the journey to the promised land passed through the wilderness, right? Mhm. And we always forget that the wilderness included serpents, scorpions, Amalachites. Yeah. Yeah. Uh Mara, bitter waters. Yeah. I can't. So, so this is the thing, right? One of the things I I I I I find amusing about us and I don't mean all of us Christians. A lot of us are following God for good times. Yeah. So we don't nobody likes bad times. Yeah. We're looking for God to guarantee us good times. So our relationship with God is successful to the extent that our life is full of good times. But in this world he says you will have trouble problems. You don't have to choose them. You got God, this is my my personal example that made me realize that there's nothing wrong with me in some in some ways. Jesus Christ saw his was with the disciples and he said to them, "Hey guys, get in that boat, right? And I will meet you on the other side." And they got in the boat. And the first thing they encountered on this or divinely ordained mission in the divinely ordained method of transportation in obedience to divine command was a storm. A storm. My theology had taught me that if I get into a storm, I am in the wrong place. Right. I'm in the wrong place. Yep. I'm doing the wrong thing. Yeah, I'm on my own pursuing my own agenda. You're on the wrong path. That is not the will of God for your life. Yes. You disobeyed your pastor. That's why you're in the storm. They told you not to marry the guy. That's why you're in the storm. Yeah. And because of the way you think. Yeah. The way you think will affect the way you feel and it will affect the way you act. Right. And what you have been taught is that if you are in a storm, you've done something wrong. So that means you're in the wrong place. So that means you have to get out of it. Right. Yeah. If you've been taught that Jesus can send you on a mission and you will get into a storm. Yeah. Right. Then your thinking becomes this storm must be part of the mission. Yeah. So my instinct is not to get out. My instinct is to say Lord there's a storm. What am I supposed to do in this storm? Not get out. Get out does not come into it. This is part of it's like you We're training for the sales. Yeah. You know, when you get to boot camp, you're going to do a 25 mile run. It's not an anomaly. It's a feature. It's not a bug. It's part of it. Yeah. The storm is not a a bug that we need to expune everything. You know that this is part of it, right? So, you you embrace it. You endure it. You're not thinking of a way out of it. That is why when we get into trouble as Christians, when we get into difficulty as Christians in relationships, in any scenario, our instinct is always how do I get out of this? Because going back to what you said, we believe that we've done something wrong to put ourselves there. Yeah. Because God can God, this is not God's will for your life. The cross was God's will for Jesus. Jesus said, "Nevertheless, not my will. I don't three times Jesus prayed." We don't talk about that. He prayed three times. He went the first time. He came back and the disciples were sleeping and he's like, "Guys, you're sleeping. Can't you just watch and you know pray with me for 1 hour?" He went back again. Came back and guys are still sleeping. Went back at Went back again. Came back and the third time he said it is done. It is set. The time has come for the son of man to be glorified. By the time he came back, it was clear what God's way was. And it was not for him to avoid the cross. Why do we always think we have to? We're going to avoid the cross. He says, "My servant, carry your cross and follow me." No, our own is not like that. Our own is soft life. Baby boy, baby girl, life forever. We like it like that. Do you see why? Do you see the problem? So when we get into dating, yeah, again, a worldly system, right? When when you pray and and and the Lord says this is your husband or this is your wife, you actually believe that you actually receive that revelation with conviction and you married the person. What makes you think God did not know that this person is exactly the way he is? That's good. Do you see what I'm saying? Yes. He's very aware. Again, what we think is so messed up and so far from scripture in many cases that I'm sure heaven is like God is probably like, "Michael, Michael, do you see that? That are you the one that told them, where do we get this stuff from that in this world, we're going to just have comfort, comfort, and more comfort?" The issue is that we don't know how to discern what God's will is and what's not God's will. If you are in Christ, if you're in Christ, more of what happens to you is God's will than not. And when bad stuff happens to you if you're in Christ, God already said to you, and we know Romans chapter 8, yeah, that in all things, God is working for the good of those who love him. and called according to his purpose. So this coconut head yeah is walking God's purpose in my life. Yeah. The Bible says I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. Christianity 101 church is not a building. It's people. Yeah. You are the church and God's promise is that the gates of hell will not prevail against you. So whatever the devil throws at you, you know because his word says no weapon that is formed against you shall succeed. It will not prosper. Yeah, we know that. He says though you walk through the fire, it will not burn you. Though you walk through the water, they will not drown you. But you will walk through the fire and you will walk through the water. You will get thrown in the lion's den. You will get thrown in the fiery furnace. the weapons of uh uh uh the weapons the weapons will be fashioned against you. Yeah, they will be formed, right? The gates will march against you. But victory is certain. So why do we fall apart? Why do we think every time there's a problem? It is because we're in the wrong place, we're in the wrong relationship, it's the wrong person. As if God did not know. The same God who knows the end from the beginning. the same God who nothing is hidden from his eyes. When when Christians after Jesus came, right, and and people were getting saved after in Jerusalem in the book of Acts, a lot of the people who are getting saved, their spouses didn't get saved. Yeah. And they wanted to leave. Mhm. But I think it was um Paul that wrote to the director of Corinth. Yeah. You know what they told them? Yeah. Stay. Mhm. Don't leave. If the spouse wants to go, the unbelieving spouse wants to leave, let him go. Let him let her go. Yep. But if they want to stay, stay with them. How do you know that it is not your faith that will convert them? You know that God can make you marry a man or a woman or God? No, he can't make it. Doesn't make you do anything. God can allow you marry a man just to save the man's soul. Just by your conduct. But do you know they'll say? They'll say, "Ah, don't be unequally yolked." Absolutely. Don't be unequally yolked. Absolutely. Don't be unequally yolked. What does light have to do with darkness? I would not see a If I was single, I would not see somebody who does not share my faith. Mhm. And think it's okay to marry them. Yep. Because then it means I don't fully understand the depth of what Christ did for me. Mhm. I think it's a super it's a superficial thing. I think it is I'm going to church. He she's going to the mosque. I don't realize that there has actually been a transformation. The earth has not seen a creature like me. But to your point, you just said that you know God would allow you to marry someone. I didn't say I said God can allow you to marry somebody. Okay. So if you say Yeah. I'm assuming you're a serious Christian now. Not one of those part-time Christians who show up only on Easter. They work only on Easter and Christmas. You know they're part-time Christians. They're off the rest of the year. Yeah. But they they on the roster for Easter Sunday. We saw a few of them this last Easter. Yeah. I'm talking about you. Anyway, sorry. Um um um if you're if you're a serious Christian, my my my expectation is a you meet a guy. I'm talking about a woman now, right? You meet a guy and you like the guy, but you will pray and say, "Lord, this guy, um, I don't know everything about him, but nothing is hidden from your eyes. Show me the things that I need to see." And if this is not the right person for me, let me know. I would assume that would be your prayer. Yeah. I would assume that you also have enough sense to seek godly counsel. Yep. Right. You would talk to people who know the guy. You will talk to your your leadership in church not because they have authority over who you marry but because they can give you godly counsel, right? You will talk to friends, parents, you will talk to a lot of folks. There's one scripture that I want us to stay here for for people to know that you talked about it in one of our Bible studies and essentially like there is safety amongst counsel. Yes. There's there's safety in a multitude of counsel, right? Multitude. Advice is good. Advice is good. With the help of the Holy Spirit, you can sift crap advice. Yeah. Right. And be like, "These people are leading me astray." Right. Well, seek counsel. Now, so you've prayed, you sought counsel, and then patience. The Bible says, "I have laid in Zion a tested cornerstone. He that believes will not make haste." Patience. Don't worry about your biological clock. Right, my pastor? Time is going. Time is going. Listen. Listen. Calm down. calm down. You can rush into a marriage and you'll be shocked. Your biological clock will shut down. Or you can take your time and yes, according to biology, your biological clock, the battery is dead. Sarah had a baby. At what age? Crazy. You know what I'm saying? God, there's nothing. I mean, we hear people have children at all sorts of ages. The problem is this, Esther. Huh? Christians are not honest about how little faith in God they have and we have so we haste for everything because we don't trust God. We think everything is dependent on our biological clock. You've seen people whose biological clock is functioning but it never reaches baby time. It never ah I pray for those. It's not dependent on your clock. It's dependent on God. I do pray for So we do things based on what God says not based on what the clock says. Yeah. Right. So three things you've done. You have prayed. Yep. You have sought counsel. Okay. And you are patient. And at the end of that process, you are like this is the person I should marry. Is he a believer? Maybe not. But you have decided. Mhm. That I have checked, gone through prayer, counseling. Um let me say this. He's not a believer in the traditional way that you think he is. Wait, you decide you want to marry somebody who is a Har Krishna adherent. Yeah, that is Wait now because people come and tell you that they prayed and God said they should marry this person. Yeah. And I'm okay with that because you know let me tell you something about God, right? I would never presume to put him in a box. I would never presume. I know what it means to not be unequally yolked with an unbeliever. But it is the same God who had spent years telling the Israelites, "Don't eat this, don't eat that, don't eat this, don't eat that." That said to Peter, "Whatsoever I've called clean, don't call unclean." Yep. So, I don't know if God has decided that you are the one that will bring this guy to heaven. So, I'm going to tell you, are you sure? The Bible says, "Do not be unequally yolked." And I've seen this guy, he doesn't look like he looks like he's ready to join the Taliban. I will tell you that. I will tell you. But if you say pastor I know in my heart that this is what the lord is saying. Yes ma'am. You know those ones even has tattoo on the brain. What I will say I will tell you what I think. I will tell you what I see. I will tell you what the word says. But I will defer to your ability your God-given right to choose your path. But don't come and tell me tomorrow. Yeah. That this person is wrong for you. Now you can tell me I made a mistake. I did not hear God. But that's a high bar for me because no, you heard God. You thought you heard God. Why do you think he didn't hear God? Ah, pastor, if it was God, this guy would not be beating me. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Jesus Christ, this might be your storm. This might just be your storm. How do you know this is not the storm? I know this is not the troubles you have in this world. Do you guys get my point? So wait, hold on. Bishop, if he's beating you, you should come out. If he's beating, you should come out. Ah, I didn't say it. I did. I say that. Yeah, I'm saying it with my Oh, I with my chest and my back. What What if she's beating you? He should be going. Why? Why? Why does anyone want to beat me? Okay. And you're not beating me for the for the sake of Christ. Okay. Absolutely. But but but but you know some people will tell you and by the way please this is my personal and ministerial philosophy. If somebody is being physically violent with you or abusive to the point of um emotional trauma. Yeah. And emotional um um um true emotional abuse. Yeah. Please separate yourself from that situation. Yes, that is my personal and pastoral advice. Having said that, yeah. Yeah. I am not going to sit here not talking generically. Yeah. Generically. Now, if I'm talking to you personally and you tell me your husband beat you, right? I know your husband and I know you. I'll go and pack your bags out of the house cuz I know your husband, right? If your husband says to me while he says to me that man PF do you know Esther ded me one slap I what are you still doing in the house that's not possible FYI but I'm just saying right yeah but I don't know you gener I you know just generically I'm not just going to be throwing advice around that oh if your husband you know because someone will tell you that he laid hands on me Mhm. When you hear that a man laid hands on a woman, what is your assumption? That he just did it out of nowhere because he picked off. No, no, no. The assumption is that he beat you. H Yeah. Let me tell you a story. Let me tell you a story. Okay. Let me tell you a story. A woman came and told me how her husband laid hands on her and she's not going to take that from any man. D. And I'm like, what? He He did what? You got to go. You got to go. You got to go. Uncle comes and says, "Pastor, she was wearing a Gucci belt." And you know those Gucci belts with the big buckle, not you know those ones, not the ones with the tiny G's. This is the rich people want. The one that the bucket the buckle is like is like a bulletproof, right? Yeah. That she was he they were in the elevator together and she was mad at him. So she took off her belt and said to whack him on the head with it. Jesus. So laying hands on her was taking the belt from her and throwing it away. But he had to take it from her forcefully. Right. That's why I'm not going to sit down here and say he laid hands on you. Right. Yeah. I have come to understand that people can be very disingenuous. They will use language that they know triggers certain responses from you. So somebody would say, "He laid hands on me. He was trying to leave. You would not let him leave. So he checked you out of the way." Right? He laid hands on me. Yeah. She was You are trying to hold her down. She would not be held down. She pushed you. Pastor, that woman, she pushed me. I banged my head against the wall. She laid hands on. Just what I'm going to say? So I'm very careful to throw generic um counsel M because they come and say pastor Fei said Mhm. Pastor Fei said if he touches me how did he touch you? If she touches me how did she touch you? Eh emotional abuse. You'll be shocked what some people call emotional abuse. Your wife goes to the goes out and spends um um she goes to the grocery store and the grocery bill for the week is $50, right? And she goes to the grocery store and spends $560 $60. I see. And then she comes home and you're like, "What the how could you? We can't afford this. We've got bills to pay." No, no, no, no, no. And then she calls her friends and says, "The abuse is too much." Wait, girl. She said he broke groceries. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. No, no, no. Guys, guys, guys, guys. I'm telling you, I'm telling you truth. The the abuse is so you can't call people out on their BS is abuse. You can't hold people accountable. It's abuse. You can't correct people. You are you're a hater. You you don't you don't you don't validate them, right? You're constantly putting them down. How do I validate you spending $560 on groceries that we don't need when our grocery bill is $50? How do how do I in what world does that demand? Oh, babe, that is mighty sweet of you. In what world am I not allowed to to to express my displeasure? Yeah. Right. But once I express anything that makes you uncomfortable, it's abuse. And that's the world we live in now, right? So, I'm not going to sit down here and say, "Pack your bags." If you're spending $560 on a $50 grocery bill, somebody needs to talk to you. Yeah. Okay. How do we get here? What were we talking about? I feel like you guys you guys triggered me. No, it was good. I mean, ultimately, we're really just, you know, talking about like how do we navigate between relationships and knowing what's right and what's not right? And you know, how do we how do we get guided by the Holy Spirit to make good decisions around, you know, dating and relationships and being in friendship and knowing the right time to transition from a friendship to a relationship, right? I can or a marriage or a marriage. Okay. So, so this is the interesting thing, right, about me is that I know, let me tell you my story. I'm I'm sure quite a few of you have heard this story. I used to be the um my first not my first I was the assistant pastor on a on a campus fellowship. We're going to have my wife on at some point, right? Yeah. And she will tell you this story better. I'm just telling you the outlines that I remember. Yeah. I was the assistant pastor of the campus fellowship and um there was this lady who used I think she was in charge of the of the printing the the the the publishing. We used to have a newsletter. Yeah. And then she eventually be got in charge of the choir and we were a group of about 15 20 people and we worked together really closely and we all became really good friends. Myself and the pastor were the only two people who were not students on the campus. Everyone else was a medical student or a house officer which is what do you call house officers in America? Um interns. Is that what they call them? A house officer. An an intern. Yeah. A house officer. medical household. When you get out of medical school, residents res officers in in in Nigeria and here they're residents. So, everybody was either a resident in the fellowship or uh a medical student, right? The pastor was a medical doctor and I was just a philosophy graduate. I wasn't a medical thing, anything. So, I I I we all hung out together. We lived together, right? We were having prayer meetings. We're having Bible study, you know, we're doing all sorts of things together, right? For months, every every every day almost of the semester. Yeah. Right. Every week, we had at least two or three meetings. In that time, we all became good friends. Yeah. Right. And I was friends with this with this girl in the fellowship. We're really good friends. We didn't have any romantic inclinations towards each other at all. Right. Um but I I I I had a lot of respect for her even though she was younger than I was because of the way she treated people in the fellowship. Right. She was four AK's how many years? AK is four years younger than I am. The way she treated people, right? Are you 56? Yeah, I was I was 56 a week a two weeks ago. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And AK is 1973. So she's 52. 52. Yeah. The way she treated people stood out to me. I'm the assistant pastor. Everybody's nice to me, right? And then I became the pastor, so people are even nicer to me. But the way she treated people stood out to me. There was a there was one boy that everybody used to rag on, man. And the guy was that was a trip. Now he's a medical doctor. He's doing excellent. Great guy. But at the time, he was just the class I don't even know what to describe him as. Yeah. The only person that was really nice to him was AK. Wow. Everyone else because she's just like that. AK is AK is a very interesting person. Well, FK is kind, but she she was just kind to him. Yeah. She wasn't fing, right? She's not a She's not an overly effusive person, right? She's not a Have you eaten? Have you had a drink? No, no, no. She's not a She's not She's just like, oh, are you doing good today? Do you need anything? And she means it. Yeah. you know, and she was so so I I I saw that. I saw the way she treated everybody. I saw her personality and in my mind, this was a good girl. This was a a kind person, right? I I I we worked together in in those roles for maybe 3 years. I I I'm not quite sure. Two or three years, I don't remember. But one summer, she goes home. She went to the east um for summer with her parents fellowship, you know, campus fellowship. Everybody went home. Yeah. And I couldn't stop thinking about her in a way that I never used to think about her. There was nothing lustful about it. I wasn't thinking about I was thinking about her sexual. I just couldn't stop thinking about her. Right. When she came back, I was so happy to see her. Right. I I started to realize that, okay, I'm starting to feel something more for this girl than is um than I feel for all the other girls in in the fellowship. So I went and I prayed and it was a bit difficult for me because I was the leader in the fellowship. I didn't want to be perceived as taking advantage of somebody who came to my you know who served under me. So I went and I prayed and I prayed and I felt a peace within me from God that this was okay. And I and one day I was walking we had a a thing and we were walking back um from the fellowship from the meeting and I said you know you might as well just say something to this girl. I said look I I I think I have fallen in love with you and I want to spend the rest of Is this how you said it like this while conversation with we were walking we were walking. Wait now we're talking about the Holy Spirit now. Are we going to say that this is your own personal journey? Wait, wait. I love that disclaimer, but but but I'm trying to prove a point. I'm trying to prove a point. I'm trying to prove a point. I said to her I said to her, right, I think I fall in love with you. You're my friend and I think I want to spend and I and I want to spend the rest of my life with you. That was my first romantic conversation with AK. And she said to me, okay, that she feels the same way. Hm. You know, I was talking about when you have the Holy Spirit inside you. Mhm. The Holy Spirit is not playing games. Mm-m. The Holy Spirit is not play hard to get. The Holy Spirit is not telling you play this, do this, like this, and do like this, like this. The Holy Spirit is not doing all of that. The Holy Spirit is is is sincere. The Holy Spirit has integrity. The Holy Spirit is not is not he's not he's not breadcrumbing. is not ghosting. He's not love bombing. The Holy Spirit is not doing all of this stuff that we do, right? And I know I was being led by the Holy Spirit. Now, am I a perfect human being? Have I done stupid crap since then? Absolutely. Has she had to ask God, okay, you put me in this boat. What's with the storm many times? Absolutely. And I've had to do the same, right? It hasn't been perfect by at least for her. For me, she's been great. I'm the one that is the problem. just no I've never had to ask God am I in the wrong boat. She's the one that I'm sure has had to ask God a few times that are you sure you're the one that said I should marry this man but I'm saying that it can be like that right it's not what who says we have to you know we never went out on a dinner date together alone one time we went out but there were always people around us right so if I had decided man tell me this baby you're not feeling her like that she would never have known there would would have never been a heartbreak, right? There would have never been a heartbreak. There would have never been a Oh, he led me on. He took me out to dinner. Said So, you never talked to anybody about this thing before? Yeah. Before you went to go talk to her? No. I spoke to a friend, a couple of my friends about it. Absolutely. But then my question is that, okay, after you said, "Hey girl, I'm in love with you." How long did you I didn't say, "Hey girl, I'm in love with you." Hey, you know, that's what we heard. That's what we heard. I didn't say, "Hey girl, I'm in love with you. I said that's not what I said. The Holy Spirit said I'm in love with you. That's not what I said. Jesus is Lord. This is why I don't tell stories to people because I know they will project their own mess on top of it. I said I think I'm in love with you. I think I've fallen in love with my friend and I want to spend the rest of my life with you. Yes. So you said no. Oh, nothing there. So you say you think so. You say you think I think I think I am because because hey, I've never I've never been in love. I don't know what love is. I just know I felt a lot of emotions for this girl. So from then and then till marriage, how long was that before y'all got actually married? Wasn't long. Maybe a year. A year and a half. So that year, how was that? How did y'all rough? It was rough. It was rough. I'll tell you why it was rough. Because there was a constant now that we had said, "Okay, we are together, right?" So what does together mean? What does that mean? We're getting together. We're getting married. Oh, okay. Cool. We're getting married. No. PF said he doesn't like courtship either. No, I didn't say courtship. I didn't say I don't like courtship. I said I don't like dating. Okay. So, you like courtship? Can I Can I finish? Sorry. Sorry. Can I finish? Thank you. It was rough. And I'll tell you why it was rough. We had decided from that first conversation we were getting married. So, we were engaged. Courtship. The implication of courtship is you're trying to decide if you're going to get engaged. Right. From my first comp. Okay. We never did boyfriend and girlfriend. I showed my fiance right and that was it. So the next step was tell the parents, right? Tell the people who needed to know, right? And you know went through that process and then start the process of getting married. Yeah. I had just left university. I had left university. She was in her final semester, final year. So she had to finish, right? You know, so there were there were there were steps. Yeah. right to to take and we went through all of those steps. But me and her now we started spending a lot of time alone, right? And that was a problem because now all the hormones kicked in, right? And that was a problem, right? We did everything we could. I I I want I I I will say clearly we never had sex, right? But it was rough. Want me to be hearing this from my pastor that we didn't have sex? What do you want me to say? that we were just smashing. you're doing me. But I'm just saying right it was it was hard because now right the gates had opened the emotions had opened you know now I'm looking at this babe I'm like um this guy is fine and of course all this is very beautiful oh she's she's she's a lovely lovely lovely lovely god did me well but but you get my point right you know and and we navigated that the best we could right but through it all yeah there was a commit treatment that was unshakable. It was unwavering. Yeah. And it kind of made things hard because if you're thinking, oh, I'm going to marry this girl now. What's stopping us? We're already getting married. Let's do this thing. But we still had that sense of, okay, do you know what? This is who we are. This is what we believe. Yeah. Don't don't do that. Right? You know, and it was I won't lie, it was hard because we just wanted to be together all the time. We wanted to be alone together. And that's what happens, right? Fortunately for us, the pro the time wasn't too long. But if anybody had come to me and said, you know, PF, man, me and this guy were getting married and somehow we just ended up, you know, sleeping together. I'm not going to beat you up. I'm going to tell you that. Well, that's what happens when you alone in the room with the light off. If that's not what you want to do, don't be alone in the room with the lights off. I mean, put yourself in comfort. It's not magic. Now, this is common sense, right? It's common sense, right? And we got married and you know, we've been married now since 1998. That's how many years? Oh, wow. I'm 1997. So, 27 27 years. Yeah. We married for 27 years. 27 years. That's a long time. Yeah. Wow. Thank you. It's She deserves the applause. Me, I just deserve a, you know, God has been good to you. You know, and that's really what happened. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure she will have a lot more detail, but that is the outline. Oh, to my question. So, you never proposed and got on one knee to ask her to be your wife. Absolutely not. Well, can I be honest with you guys? I know I said that thing is a problem and I think it's a problem. I think that I think that you see these are these are the things he say he said no business. Let me tell you let me tell you why I think people human beings right one of the things that I seen in counseling Mhm. in a lot of times is that when men are pursuing women, they are put in this role of a supplicant. Right. It's kind of like I want something from you. Yeah. So I am I I am at in a lower position kind of. Mhm. Right. You call the shots. Yeah. When the man feels like okay it has balance now we are married right it's even yeah then he wants to assert himself because he's he's spent all this time doing whatever it is you wanted right part of it is that humiliating get down on one knee to propose to your wife and by the way when I say humiliating please it's not humiliating for everybody some men are perfectly happy with it please if you are happy with it right on. Hopefully, you do it only once in your life so you don't have to do it over and over and over again. But please, I'm not knocking it in that sense. I just think I I I never had to assert myself. I never had to show my wife that I'm the man of the house, John. I never had to rebalance the equation. And but that's what we're taught though. I think that's why the expectation is there. So, and those are some of the things that are a problem, right? We we start off with a okay because I'm chasing this babe, right? She'll tell me when to show up. She will tell me where we're going to eat. She gets to determine and decide. It's all about making her happy. Mhm. Right. When we get married, that thing is going to change. Yep. It has to change. Yeah. You know, and and a lot of guys take that as a mission. Yeah. And it's not nice. Right. If you are the young men these days are not like that. the young men from the get- go are like, "No, 50/50 from the get- go." But my generation of men, we kind of had this thing, you know, that, oh, you know, women are the weaker sex, so they get what they want and then when you get married, you have to rebalance it. And that's nonsense. That's nonsense. Train a child in the way that the child should go and when he's old, he will not depart from it. Well, guys, this episode is going to cause problems. these two episodes. Well, if they want to see more, they have questions to ask, we are thinking about doing a live podcast and we would love for you guys to tell us if that's something that you're interested in. So, please comment and let us know. And you will not allowed to be you not allowed to bring you will not be allowed to bring in rotten tomatoes, rotten eggs, and rotten cabbage cuz nobody's throwing anything at me. Yeah, I know. After this, I I I heard that some people were not happy with the answer I gave to the feminists. Well, it is what it is. It is what it is. I'm not perfect, man. I'm just a man that's pursuing after Jesus. Yeah, exactly. Super flawed with super unfiltered opinions that should be filtered sometimes. Well, that's why this is PF unfiltered. Thank you guys for joining us. Thank you. Thank you so much. Please share and we'll see you all next time. Bye. Unfiltered. [Music]